Just a place to post some stuff. It's mostly OUAT and SwanFire related with the occational off-topic rant. (Don't give me shit about the anon ask. I know there are plenty of nice anons out there, but there are also many who are just haters. If you don't want to be traced back to your blog, why should I listen to you?)
I know this was asked a while back but I thought I’d add on to the “OUaT bad writing” examples.
1) The premise of the show is that the Dark One took nearly 300 years and countless manipulations in order to travel realms. Since Emma broke the memory curse this has now been “accomplished” TEN times in the course of roughly two seasons. Examples:
- Emma/MM going to the EF
- Emma/MM getting back to SB
- Cora/Hook getting to SB
- Neal going to the EF
- Tamara/Greg/Henry going to NL
- Emma and the gang going to NL
- Neal going from EF to NL
- Everyone getting back from NL
- Everyone save Emma going back to the EF
- Everyone coming back to SB from the EF
Now they may all be going back in the past to the EF? Was the Dark One just twidling his thumbs or something in the years he should have been doing something?
2) Regina got the idea to seperate Henry from everyone and make him love her THREE times in S2. (when Emma/MM went through the portal, when Cora came back, just before she was taken by Greg/Tamara). Three times in the course of the series would have been excessive, but one season is overkill. Especially when you take into account the loose time-passing of the show. If S2 took place over the course of a month, Regina got that idea practically once a week.
3) Another thing about realm travelling-Jack and the giants. They had viable beans. Why should I believe the Dark One didn’t just pop up there, grab some beans, and go about his business of getting his son back? Why should I believe he had to enact this whole curse that had Maleficent shocked, when he could have just had his answer with a simple materialization?
4) Dropped storylines-even not taking into account the secondary characters, there are several dropped storylines on the show. Snow’s dark heart? It was featured for one episode, maybe two, and then never spoken of again.They’ve manipulated the characters emotions to fit with what they want to do. This week-we want Regina to be horrible, so we’ll have Henry hate her. Oh, this week, we want everyone to feel sorry for Regina, so we’ll make Henry her great defender. Emma not being the least bit suspicious when a supposed dead Archie shows up at her door? Yes Pongo was reacting positively to Archie but why wouldn’t Emma be the least bit suspicious? Especially knowing there’s dark magic involved. Why did she not ask him something about the mine? They’ve also done the emotional flip flop with Snow. Oh we want drama with Snowing-let’s have MM not want to go back to the EF. Oh, this week we need to convince Emma-okay MM totally wants to go back. Yeah, we’ve been highlighting how sad MM was to not be a part of Emma’s life, so let’s just have her decide to abandon her to be with David in NL, without the slightest conversation about that topic between them. Wrt secondary characters, I get not all actors are available for an appearance, but it does not in any way proculde them from being mentioned. Would it be so hard to have this;
Henry: I’m going to play with Grace at the park!
Emma: Well don’t drink anything her father offers you!
What about the Lost Boys from NL? The one’s Emma promised homes and parents to (you know, when the writers had her usurp Wendy’s role)? When Regina reversed the curse, what happened to them? We haven’t heard a word of it.
5) Neal’s death-I know this is a hot topic in the fandom, but whether you love or hate Neal, his death was handled miserably. If A&E did get the idea to kill him off b/t S2 and S3, then they should have just let him die after deliviering a message to Aurora and Co. Rather than bringing him back and killing him HALF A SEASON later. The impact of the death is minimized and the GA is just going to be confused as to why they didn’t just do it ten episodes or whatever ago. Hook could have taken over his role in NL (which he really should have, tbh).
6) Too much action, not enough dialogue-to the best of my knowledge, even JMo and Ginny have stated this. The characters have no time to process anything, because it’s just going from one “adventure” to the next, We get minimal indication of how things affect various characters because they rarely just talk. When we do get an emotional reaction, it seems out of the blue. Good writing should not make one go “holy shit, they are actually acknowleding their past! Holy hot damn!”
7) Major conversations happening off screen. One example is Emma finding out Neal had intended for her to have the $20,000 and the car. We saw the after effects of it, but not the actual conversation about it. Whatever you ship, this would be a MAJOR thing for Emma. There is no actual reason we should not have seen this on screen. In addition, a lot of characters acting OOC. Regina escapes from the damn tree in NL, because she had no regrets because her actions got her, her son. Fair enough, but now, she’s not even debating with Emma about Henry getting his memories back? That is the epitome of lazy writing.
8) Overuse of magic-there’s a problem? Just wave your hand. Disguise yourself as somebody else (a la Cora). Oh we need to get some memories back to have a semi-emotinal thing? Have the BF pull a magic potion out of her rear at the last second (rather than the extended time before when the special ingredient-something of reverted August’s was available for a while.) Oh yeah, we’ve said the BF is supposed to be more powerful than Rumple…but only when it is convenient for us.Good writing does not establish things, then just ignores them, because it fits whatever plot arc is wanting to be persued. Good writing adheres to the established boundries, If they want the BF to be shady, they should have had a scene with her, denying being able to make the potion, only to show her doing it right after. This is just one example of a convenient retcon for the purpose of a desired storyline. Again, bad writing.
9) Villians cannot just be villians. Yes, there is something to be said about shades of gray. But the excessive “why couldn’t x just love me and have a happily ever after with me” just gets tedious. Show me a villian who just doesn’t care. Show me a villian who doesn’t have a sob story. People have loved villians since the start of storytelling. People love Tony Soprono, Hannibal Lecter, Nucky Thompson, Tywin Lannister, Loki, Darth Vader, Moriarty and many others. Liking a villian does not make one a bad person. Good storytelling makes one feel slightly bad about rooting for the bad guy, but it doesn’t make one defend the villian to the death. Understanding motivation and condoning it are two very different things, and good storytelling makes the distinction clear.
10) Convuluted family tree-this is not supposed to be a soap opera. And don’t even get me started on the whole “haven’t you heard of European royalty” ( I live in an European country that has a queen so yes, I’ve heard of it). The EF might be small, but there’s no reason for someone with a grudge to be a blood relation (or seriously connected to one with a blood relation). With good writing, you can wrap someone into the fold without having to have a fall back. But that is exactly what they’ve done almost every time. They don’t care to create a motivation outside of “I was wronged by x who happens to be powerful/royalty”. Once again, lazy writing.
These are the most prevelent examples I can think of. Very sorry for the length. It’s the things I’ve had on my mind but fear putting them on my blog for fear of anon hate. So thanks for giving me the place to state this. Especially if you’ve read to this point, lol.
From now on, I’ll ask new viewer to stay away from OUAT for their own good.
- Frequent allusions to rape are hysterical, sexy, and entirely necessary for intriguing storytelling.
- ’Boy toy’ is a perfectly acceptable term when referring to male sexual assault victims (see above for why).
- It’s not possible for a woman to have zero interest in a super hot guy. Any resistance shown is just her ‘making you work hard for her attention’.
- If you want someone, no matter what the reason, it’s automatically love. Even if you know virtually nothing about the other individual and are only interested in them for shallow motivations like their looks/power/status/a shared hard-on for revenge/etc., it still qualifies as ‘love’ regardless. Because standards for defining something that important shouldn’t exist.
- Wearing short dresses and spending your time in bars is synonymous with being a callous slut who will bail on your dates and cheer when witnessing innocent strangers being beaten up with a cane!
- If destiny dictates that you end up with a certain person but you choose not to pursue them regardless, both your life and theirs should be considered irrevocably ‘ruined’. Even if your supposed soul mate ended up with an adoring wife and child anyway.
- True love for secondary characters means dropping everything they were or cared about previously so that their entire lives can revolve around their designated ‘core-six’ soul mate.
- Bestiality can be a prominently featured storyline when setting up a seasonal arc, but same-sex love between two human women can only be vaguely hinted at for less than two minutes in the entire program’s run. Because, you know, ‘family show’.
- No matter how horribly you’ve treated innocents or used your power to leverage control over others, as long as you have a super-sad backstory, you can’t possibly really be a difficult man to love. Indeed, the fact that you ever emphatically believed that will eventually be retconned entirely and it will end up turning out that all the women really want you.
- If you happen to fall on the far right side of the morality scale, you can’t be shown having intimate moments with your significant other unless you’re properly married first. Because, as we all well know, sex is automatically ‘dirty’ and ‘vulgar’ if you ain’t got a ring on it. So sorry Belle, unless you’ve undergone a thorough memory wipe first, the only indication we’re going to get that you’re a sexual being is a brief shot of you leaving Gold’s bed in a nighty and some blink-and-you’ll-miss-it thigh touching.
- Not to worry though! Because in order to ensure your boyfriend can fulfill his Mr. Fanservice obligations anyway, we’re going to retcon the ever-loving shit out of him and do all manner of storytelling jumping jacks to shoehorn in various sexual scenarios with other villains. Who also happen to be mother and daughter! Which brings us to point 9:
- Multiple incestuous storylines on a Disney channel is totes sexxxxxxy!!!! Especially if they’re also heavily laced with sociopathic levels of infatuation, stalking and out-right sexual assault: that just means it’s LOVE!
- Your long-term worth as a character is entirely dependent on how many super-vocal, die-hard shippers you attract to the show. If you are not part of your designated SO’s largest heterosexual ship, then sorry my dear, you’re expendable and will in fact be killed off several times over before broomed from the program entirely.
It’s really sad especially the last one.
I am working on a revision of Henry’s family tree. Anyone remember if Zelena’s adoptive parents have names?
but have never sexually assaulted anyone/made creepy rape jokes and are in a consensual monogamous relationship, you may think you are safe from being a victim of sexual assault. Unfortunately, not only is this not true, but an outside observer might doubt you’ve ever had sex with your consenting S.O., and think you’ve had more sexual interaction with a woman who controls you against your will than with your true love. If you’re emotionally stunted from pursuing a 300+ year revenge quest, 3/4 never fear! Simply follow your new object of obsession, watch her when she’s with other people, undermine the confidence of her other love interest and fake an old friendship with him once he’s safely dead, help fix the problems you caused in the first place, and don’t take no for an answer until she takes pity on you and stops “making you work so hard for her attention.” If you’re a good person who made one mistake, I have some bad news: you’re going to die, and even though death had a revolving door installed for this show, you’re going to be gone, and forgotten, for good after one episode. Your son will think you were a deadbeat and hang out with the guy your mom ran off with who later sold you to your crazy relative because you didn’t want to play happy families with him, and your old girlfriend who you wanted to marry is going to marry him instead, without ever mentioning you again. Your father will miss you when it furthers his manpain, though. Congratulations.
So true and depressing. Poor Neal.
So, Hook’s redeemed.
Because Hookfire-that-never-really-was is now the icing on the cake of that emergent ‘heroism’.
In “It’s Not Easy Being Green” who has the most to say about Neal? Who, for example, gets to say ‘Neal’ or ‘Bae’ or ‘Baelfire’ or ‘your father’ more than any other character? In the episode immediately after that character’s death?
Emma, you’ll say. It’s Emma. She held Neal as he died. Seemed upset in the moment.
No, wait. No, it’s Rumple. Bae was his boy. His precious boy. He cursed an unknown (to us) number of people just to find Bae again and tell him he was sorry, that he loved him. So it’s got to be Rumple. Absolutely Rumple.
But it’s not. All the variations of Neal’s name—they’re given to Hook, Neal’s victimizer, to say, to wax (inaccurately) nostalgic about, to speak in starts and stops and considered pauses. To stand with Neal’s (as ignorant of his father as he is of what Hook really did to him) son and show him stars and form a bond and — like, is that a bloody second chance for Hook? Should we applaud that since Emma gave Henry into his keeping that he didn’t, I don’t know — turn Henry immediately over to the WW to gain her good favor? He may have sold out the boy’s father but hey, this time he actually took a boy back to his mum!
(In some ways I’m starting to see Hook/Bae and Henry turning into Regina/Owen and Henry (and now Roland?) Can’t get things to turn out the way you want them to the first time? Totally betrayed and screwed up that first child, took a parent away from them? Try again with a shiny new kid!)
But, really, you give HOOK all the words (yes, I know Emma said about three words) about Neal in the episode immediately after he died. You have HOOK with Neal’s son, ‘guiding’ him, offering to ease him through learning that his father is dead.
You are really going to put Neal’s death into building and solidifying Hook’s transition from villain to hero? You gonna add the death of one of Hook’s *victims* to build him up on that journey?
Bold storytelling, my friends. Observe and learn.
Here’s the thing: could a villain’s victim cause a change in them? Could that person be either the initial spark in a character reversal, or a final straw before their rehabilitation? Yes.
But this show never created anything present day between Neal and Hook. Two awkward micro-conversations (more really dialogue exchanges—two, maybe three lines).
Everything Hook muses on about Neal is about BAE. In the hospital he even ridiculously says that when he looks at a grown Neal he sees Bae. (By which he means he sees the boy prior to when he betrayed him.)
He’s fixated on Bae. But not on the “real” Bae. On some sort of ‘fairytale’ version of Bae and him having halcyon days together where they bonded and learned from each other, and as far as the show has shown us on film that cannot be backed up by what we’ve been shown on film.
So if Hook is fixated on the REALITY of what happened between him and Bae (which was that he betrayed a solitary, helpless boy to—what did Hook call Pan? It was pretty bad…) HE WOULD CONFESS HIS TRANGRESSION TO SOMEONE. He would tell what happened and his part in it and move from confession to contrition. Story-wise, that would make sense that Neal’s death might create that happening within him.
However, Hook speaks only of his time with Bae while wearing rose-colored blinders. Once upon a time, Hook and Bae were buds who traveled together and Hook was wise and knowing and taught Bae and took him under his wing, and THERE IS NO SUGGESTION EVEN THAT ANYTHING OTHER THAN THAT HAPPENED. These speeches and shots are not even underscored with dramatic irony (that we know otherwise) or with any tension that what Hook is saying is not full disclosure.
So, how could Hook ACTUALLY mourn Neal? Neal was the truth. Neal was what Bae actually was then, and what Hook’s betrayal caused him to become.
Hook can only mourn this fictional version of Bae he (and the show, now) have created.
Perfect, won’t cause trouble to you Bae. Bae, who stayed with Hook on something like an indefinite camping trip. Bae, who was not the son of the Dark One. Bae, who never came at him with a sword, Bae who was not the perfect price for Hook’s continual freedom in Neverland.
Hook can’t share anything about _Neal_ unless they make him come to terms and confess what he really did there.
Which it pretty clearly seems like they’re never going to do.
In fact, dollars to donuts says that by the time everyone regains their memories (Henry included) the show will be so far away from Neal’s death, no mourning will occur there either.
By killing Neal (Michael Raymond-James), have you robbed Emma of a happy ending?
Kitsis: Yes, and she will be miserable from here on out. No! We haven’t robbed anyone of anything. We’ve always said on this show that happy endings are something you have to work for. They don’t come overnight.
Thanks for taking THAT seriously! Come on, guys, why do they have to treat this like a joke?
Seriously, what is wrong with the cast? If it was such a benevolent parting of ways and these people are supposed to be MRJ’s “friends for life” why have they all disappeared into the Twitter woodpile since the episode aired? They can’t even break radio silence to say how much fun they had working with him? That they wish him luck? That they hope he can return in some capacity as they all did about Jamie Dornan? Instead it’s like they’re all ashamed or something, but it comes off as being really dickish and cowardly, IMO. Maybe they think if they stay silent Adam can take all of the shit, but I don’t think anyone is blaming THEM for killing off Neal, just for jumping on the CS promotion bandwagon — which, for all we know, they were compelled into doing to get a raise in their contract negotiations. But instead we get generic next episode promotion and more “I am such a dramatic art photographer” crap from Josh that’s just really offensive considering the utter lack of sincerity that Adam has shown. On the whole, the cast has been just terrible during 3B with their @OnceABC promoting of trashy entertainment blogs and BtS photos in which they try to turn something absurd into classy high art. I realize that in Hollywood, shows and actors come and go, and I also realize they are in the home stretch of filming the season finale, but treating the fans like none of this matters, like they don’t care that our hearts are breaking, is just cruel. OUAT, what has happened to you? Is it art imitating life or is life behind the scenes imitating art? The climate of apathy being projected is just unbearable. Really, you should all be ashamed.